Th formr is a pipedream,
and we can se from our own histry we'r not havng much
success in making it hapn. Th latr is even mor of a
pipedream. Pronunciation chanjes - somtimes as a fad
- from time to time, from place to place, from class
to class. It canot be chaind, or even prescribed. (We
thot we'd brot up our childrn propr like, but they
aint speakng quite th same as us.) Spelng is a tool
of riting and readng, not of speakng. It may or may
not (eg, chinese) reflect pronunciation. It is
desirebl, in an alfabeticl systm desynd for such a
purpose, that ther be som link between speakng and
riting, and hence between speakng and spelng.
But it is not necesary for it to be precise or
absolute. Wat is necesary is that spelng becoms
fairly consistnt and predictbl, and that Taam,
Ian, Ron, John, Val, I, and al of us shud be able to
read each othrs riting without our varius accents
getng in th way. In th process th riting
wil giv som idea of pronunciation,
even tho this difrs from place to place, time to
time, class to class.
I'm sory, but I find Taam, Ian, and Ron's posts ·
tryng to reflect pronunciation - DIFICLT TO
READ (repeat: DIFICLT TO READ), and I
somtimes giv up befor th end. (Maybe they find my CS
riting also dificlt to read.) WE'R AL INTRESTD in
simplifyng spelng. If we find it dificlt wat wud it
al be like to those without such an intrest?
I wud sujest our time and enrjy cud be betr spent
in devising ways of propagating SOM FORM OF MODRAT
CHANJE rathr than pursuing pipedreams. Discussng and
formulating pipedreams (in this case, spelng and
pronunciation being tytly related) is fine as a mentl
exercise (such as playng chess or solvng a cryptic
crossword) but lets not se it as doing much for th
cause, othr than perhaps as being a distnt but not
criticl refrnce point. We'r in th busness of
promoting chanje, and we shud be getng on with it!
I shal now retreat to th stokades to prepare for
th onslaut. Cheers, anyway,
Allan
Although I agree in principle with the Allan's
position, I don't think there would be much agreement
in practice. I don't think that cut spelling is the
end of the line.
I don't think that the broad romic that most of us
pipedreamers are advocating is a case of exactly
reflecting pronunciation. It is as close as divergent
dialects will allow and would eventually be based on
a new pronunciation dictionary for world english. I
don't think it is so close that it will have to be
revised every 50 years. It should last 200 years
because it is not that exact. No phonemic notation is
going to look like TO more than 40% of the time so
the notation is going to take some getting used to.
Schwa
Discussion Ian Ascott
'b^t /
abut, sil^nt / silent, mar'tym / maritime
c'nect / connect, circ's, osh'n, fizish'n,
apt'n, phonish/n, feim's. am's, byur'crat,
caes'm, w's, fl'd, r'f.
Shwa
Every vowel and many
vowel combinations can represent the shwa.
a
|
e
|
i
|
o
|
u
|
| alphabet |
chapel |
dormitory |
actor |
faculty |
alph bet |
chap l |
dorm tory |
act r |
fac lty |
Evri vaul and meni
vaul kombine5nz kan reprizent x shwa.
Capitalized
Shwa
Abut, silEnt, marItime, cOnnect, circUs, ocEAn,
verandA, captAIn, phonitIAn, famOUs, animOUs, animAl,
AmOs, enimA, verandA, cOnekt, amOs, Okeisha'n,
alfAbet, chapEl, dormItory, actOr, facUlty, silEnt,
marItime, circUs, captAIn, fashIOn, physicIAn,
auctIOn, burEAUcrat, examp[]le, chasOm,
Ron, You wrote Ie
think dhat aul wee hav too doo iz too a'gree on a
grafeem faur the IPA shwaa and wee hav a speling
sist'm.
(Ian) Dhee is stil [c], which evriwan sjms afraid
of, but which is rjli redundcnt.
Ie wuud aksept eni ov the ridund'nt let'rz bikoz
ie am shoor dhae wil not giv eni trub'l too leurn'rz
in fuech'r
Naur wil taek TO ues'rz long too get ues too it
bikoz it iz soe eezi too und'stand
(Ron) Dhaer iz the shwaa sound in Inglish. Dhaer
iz noe grafeem faur it. Heer iz wun. It wil maek
speling eezi'r.
Heer aar the shwaa weurdz from abuv
TO <c <x <q agree agrj xgree qgree
computer kompiutc kxmpuetxr kqmpuetqr concise konsais
kxnsies kqnsies easier jzic (z=sh TO) eezixr eeziqr
future fiutzc fuechxr fuechqr learners lerncz
leurnxrz leurnqrz personally personcli peursxnxli
peursqnqli suggesting sajestiq sxjesting sqjesting
trouble trabl (trabcl) trubxl trubql understand
andcstand undxstand undqstand users yuzcz uesxrz
uesqrz